What is an incel? What is "Incel ideology"?

[Memento Mori]

Incels do not exist.

I disagree with this because it disregards the existence of chronically single people/virgins on a wider scale and their challenges, as well as the stigma associated with them.

It seems like you're eager to discard the incel term due to the baggage associated with it, but I'm impartial and see it for what it is, the life condition and culture/identity being two separate things.

 

[Depresso]

I disagree with this because it disregards the existence of chronically single people/virgins on a wider scale and their challenges, as well as the stigma associated with them.

No it doesn't, I have personally seen many people, women and men, self-describe as chronically single. I just Googled the phrase and got many hits for articles, no one is disregarding any of that.

It seems like you're eager to discard the incel term due to the baggage associated with it, but I'm impartial and see it for what it is, the life condition and culture/identity being two separate things.

Yes, because the word is the baggage which weighs down the real voices and the real problems associated with being chronically single and lonely.

"Incel" is a joke.

 

[Depresso]

Did you know that the original founders of the Incel Wiki were anti-blackpill moderates who had their wiki hijacked by forum staff? Interesting read tbh and a lot of the content there informs my views.

Did the blackpill masculinists start with PUAHate? The media and other "bigs" are full of psychopaths so that's to be expected.

 

[Memento Mori]

Yes, because the word is the baggage which weighs down the real voices and the real problems associated with being chronically single and lonely.

"Incel" is a joke.

I agree there is baggage which weighs down the issues of singleness and loneliness but it's not the fault of the term itself, rather, the predominant 'Blackpilled' incel culture which clouds discussion around the issue.

The first Involuntary Celibacy forums started in 1997 and were dual-gender and non-ideological. It wasn't until 2011 when 'Blackpill' was first conceptualized within the manosphere that most self-identified incels associated with blackpill communities/forums.

 

[Schwarzwald]

I've just been reading along as an outsider, so take this for what it's worth.

It seems like you're both arguing about the label while the actual experience, chronic loneliness, undesired celibacy, whatever you want to call it, is sitting right there. Mentalatte says you're only an incel if you want to be, but from the outside, that sounds a lot like telling someone in a cage they're only a prisoner if they identify with the warden's language. The bars are biology, tech, social dynamics, not just self-identification.

I'm not trying to pick a side. I just wonder: does arguing over the definition help anyone who's actually struggling? Or does it just give everyone something to talk about instead of sitting with how miserable that reality is?

I'm not going to address the people who wear it a badge or shield even...

 

[Depresso]

View attachment 14938

I've just been reading along as an outsider, so take this for what it's worth.

It seems like you're both arguing about the label while the actual experience, chronic loneliness, undesired celibacy, whatever you want to call it, is sitting right there. Mentalatte says you're only an incel if you want to be, but from the outside, that sounds a lot like telling someone in a cage they're only a prisoner if they identify with the warden's language. The bars are biology, tech, social dynamics, not just self-identification.

I'm not trying to pick a side. I just wonder: does arguing over the definition help anyone who's actually struggling? Or does it just give everyone something to talk about instead of sitting with how miserable that reality is?

Why do they need to invent an identity around something they want to go away? The problems exist, so why can't they describe their problems properly? A good description is part of the solution.

I'm not going to address the people who wear it a badge or shield even...

The people who wear it as a badge are the problem with the word, heck they are the word.

 

[Memento Mori]

Why do they need to invent an identity around something they want to go away? The problems exist, so why can't they describe their problems properly? A good description is part of the solution.


The people who wear it as a badge are the problem with the word, heck they are the word.

I agree there is baggage which weighs down the issues of singleness and loneliness but it's not the fault of the term itself, rather, the predominant 'Blackpilled' incel culture which clouds discussion around the issue.

The first Involuntary Celibacy forums started in 1997 and were dual-gender and non-ideological. It wasn't until 2011 when 'Blackpill' was first conceptualized within the manosphere that most self-identified incels associated with blackpill communities/forums.

See my response above. Incels aren't a monolith.

 

[Depresso]

See my response above. Incels aren't a monolith.

Why do you defend the word?

 

[Memento Mori]

Why do you defend the word?

Because I'm impartial to it and can delineate between the situation it describes and the various communities which have surrounded it.

You'd understand my position if you fully read through the screencap and the link in my post.

 

[Depresso]

See my response above. Incels aren't a monolith.

Here are some definitions.

Oxford learner:

Webster:

Collins:

 

[Depresso]

Because I'm impartial to it and can delineate between the situation it describes and the various communities which have surrounded it.

I fully understand this.

You'd understand my position if you fully read through the screencap and the link in my post.

This too.

It's a new word that's not in the oed. Why does it need to exist?

 

[Memento Mori]

It's a new word that's not in the oed. Why does it need to exist?

Well, it doesn't have to. But one can use the term properly without invoking it to mean self-identified 'incels'.

 

[Schwarzwald]

Why do they need to invent an identity around something they want to go away? The problems exist, so why can't they describe their problems properly? A good description is part of the solution.


The people who wear it as a badge are the problem with the word, heck they are the word.

I think we're talking past each other juuuuuuuust a little. You want a fix, I'm just observing.

My unglamorous take; don't make your suffering your whole identity, and don't surround yourself with people who only agree with you. Do your thing, stay in your lane, pursue your goals. If someone shows up, great. If not, also fine. That's not 'cope', it's just not building a prison out of your own unmet desires.

The label debate is a distraction. The bars are real. But you don't have to decorate them.

2 cents. That's all.

 

[Depresso]

Well, it doesn't have to. But one can use the term properly without invoking it to mean self-identified 'incels'.

Do you think it's ever used properly? I think most times it's used it's loaded.

I'll start work on the longer post.

 

[Memento Mori]

Do you think it's ever used properly? I think most times it's used it's loaded.

I'll start work on the longer post.

Yeah, ever since the term entered popular discourse, people outside the sphere have used it properly at times.

But like @Schwarzwald said, there's not much value in deconstructing incel and its history. I've stopped posting threads about incel topics for a while now because they aren't productive in any way.